Need urgent help, stock turbo removal

[Mandinca]

I am swapping my smoking KO4 for a rebuild and I have everything off except the oil return and the coolant return. The oil return connects under the turbo, I can't see it never mind get a wrench/socket etc on it. The coolant return I may be able to get off when the oil return is undone (if removing the oil return lets the turbo move around more.).
I had a look at where the oil return bolts to the block, not sure if I can get a wrench on that either. So close and can't get it off.
One thing I noticed is that even with just these two lines still connected it still feels like it's attached somehow, is that normal or am I maybe missing a bolt. It moves around a lot but just feels like there's more holding it on than just the oil and coolant return lines.
I removed the 5 from the DP and the 4 from the mani, the bolt down under the EGR, I can't see anything else.
Does anyone have any suggestions - do not want to put it back together and drive it to Mazda.

[ladan]

You should be able to remove the two bolts for the oil outlet from under the car.

There is also a 10 mm bolt (14 or 17mm wrench) that is holding the turbo from beneath .
Hope you have solved this, or this will help

[Mandinca]

Unfortunately I ran out of time, this is my daily driver so I had to put it back together again. I couldn’t even see the turbo from underneath the car unless I was just not looking in the right place. I was kinda feeling defeated by then anyway.
A local shop just quoted me $850 to do it.
F me, two bolts and a hose clamp away.
Maybe I’ll have another go at it before I take it in. For one thing, I can’t see it taking me 3 hours to get the manifold off next time.
Where is the bolt holding the turbo on underneath, on the turbo bracket which is triangular shaped ?
If so the dealer didn't bother to put it back in when they replaced it under warranty at 20K.
The cold side of my turbo looks like this, caked on oil residue. Could just be that the seals are failing….

[ladan]

Yes it´s in the triangle shaped one, you can see on the picture. The bracket on the oil inlet bolts to the exhaust manual, so it has to go if you are removing the manifold to.

This is not easy work to do, but it´s better to remove the hood to get better access. Some have also removed the plastic on the firewall to get better space.

You can find it in how to´s

Are you going to use stock k04 again?

If it´s smoking a lot, it could be good idea to measure the crankcase pressure, before you remove the turbo.

Easy to do, just use cheap pressure gauge and route it from the engine dipstick pipe to inside, then take a run (wot) and see what it does.

My car was smoking a lot in i pulled to turbo out and got it reworked, but was still smoking a lot.
Then I did measure the pressure and got 7 psi, which is way to HIGH.

Afterwards I did a compression test, which resulted to be a crack in cylinder sleeve.

[Mandinca]

What kind of pressure gauge am I looking for and do I put it in the end of the dipstick pipe or does it need to be inserted into the block where the dipstick pipe connects ?
I may as well test the pressure before I start trying to replace this KO4 again. I recently replaced the PCV valve as well.
I checked my compressions and got varying results, sometimes 2 and 3 would read as low as 90 (if I did 8 cranks) and other times it was up to 180, on the same cylinder.(if I cranked for 8 seconds). The low reading was strange but the high reading was right on the numbers from the shop manual.

I’m using a rebuilt KO4 to replace the old one.

[fivefingerdeathpunch]

FWIW i couldnt really see the bolts from underneath either. transfer case/awd on ms6 really makes the job harder. i posted up on your thread on m6c how i did it but it likely will be harder for you with your stock DP.

also i loosened/moved the black bracket at the bottom of the picture you posted in order to help fit my hand underneath the turbo from that side.

[Mandinca]

Originally Posted by fivefingerdeathpunch FWIW i couldnt really see the bolts from underneath either. transfer case/awd on ms6 really makes the job harder. i posted up on your thread on m6c how i did it but it likely will be harder for you with your stock DP. also i loosened/moved the black bracket at the bottom of the picture you posted in order to help fit my hand underneath the turbo from that side.

How did you do that ? Mine looked like it was part of a metal pipe that was connected out of sight.
Are you DubD on M6c ?

[fivefingerdeathpunch]

i have the same name on both


as for the bracket maybe im confusing two brackets but i know i moved a black bracket on the intake side below the turbo. it may have been a rotational move so that it wasnt sticking up but it definitely moved. look at the picture you posted i may have unclipped it from the top hose then rotated it down so that it didnt stick up. gave a bit of room. either way read my post of m6c and see if any of that is possible for you with the stock DP

[ladan]

Originally Posted by Mandinca What kind of pressure gauge am I looking for and do I put it in the end of the dipstick pipe or does it need to be inserted into the block where the dipstick pipe connects ? I may as well test the pressure before I start trying to replace this KO4 again. I recently replaced the PCV valve as well. I checked my compressions and got varying results, sometimes 2 and 3 would read as low as 90 (if I did 8 cranks) and other times it was up to 180, on the same cylinder.(if I cranked for 8 seconds). The low reading was strange but the high reading was right on the numbers from the shop manual. I’m using a rebuilt KO4 to replace the old one.

Just use a cheap boost gauge like this one:
2" 52mm Motor Car Mechanical Tinted Turbo Boost Gauge Bar LED | eBay

Remove the dipstik and get hose that fits tight over it, then route the hose inside your car.

[silvapain]

The oil drain bolts are 8mm. I use a ratcheting wrench for the bolts to the block, and a socket and a shit-ton of extensions to get to the bolts on the turbo.

Unbolt it all from underneath the car.

[Mandinca]

Originally Posted by fivefingerdeathpunch i have the same name on both as for the bracket maybe im confusing two brackets but i know i moved a black bracket on the intake side below the turbo. it may have been a rotational move so that it wasnt sticking up but it definitely moved. look at the picture you posted i may have unclipped it from the top hose then rotated it down so that it didnt stick up. gave a bit of room. either way read my post of m6c and see if any of that is possible for you with the stock DP

That would make sense that it would rotate around the hose it was on. I figured the bracket was there to support the turbo, instead the bracket is there so the turbo can support the pipe that the bracket is wrapped around.

Originally Posted by ladan Just use a cheap boost gauge like this one: 2" 52mm Motor Car Mechanical Tinted Turbo Boost Gauge Bar LED | eBay Remove the dipstik and get hose that fits tight over it, then route the hose inside your car.

Even though it measures in BAR instead of psi ?

Originally Posted by silvapain The oil drain bolts are 8mm. I use a ratcheting wrench for the bolts to the block, and a socket and a shit-ton of extensions to get to the bolts on the turbo. Unbolt it all from underneath the car.

I can't see it from underneath the car, the transfer case completely blocks it.

[ladan]

It would be better to use psi gauge, but you could try, of it goes over zero you have some kind of a problem.

[Heartbreak1]

Originally Posted by Mandinca I am swapping my smoking KO4 for a rebuild and I have everything off except the oil return and the coolant return. The oil return connects under the turbo, I can't see it never mind get a wrench/socket etc on it. The coolant return I may be able to get off when the oil return is undone (if removing the oil return lets the turbo move around more.). I had a look at where the oil return bolts to the block, not sure if I can get a wrench on that either. So close and can't get it off. One thing I noticed is that even with just these two lines still connected it still feels like it's attached somehow, is that normal or am I maybe missing a bolt. It moves around a lot but just feels like there's more holding it on than just the oil and coolant return lines. I removed the 5 from the DP and the 4 from the mani, the bolt down under the EGR, I can't see anything else. Does anyone have any suggestions - do not want to put it back together and drive it to Mazda.

I would appreciate some help too. I'm trying to replace my turbo and I'm having trouble taking off the heat shields and exhaust manifold. My friend says we have to lift the car, but I didn't think so. I've searched for a while for a guide to this, but to no avail. If you could help me out or point me in the right direction, that would be great. Thanks.

[Code Monkey]

Originally Posted by Heartbreak1 I would appreciate some help too. I'm trying to replace my turbo and I'm having trouble taking off the heat shields and exhaust manifold. My friend says we have to lift the car, but I didn't think so. I've searched for a while for a guide to this, but to no avail. If you could help me out or point me in the right direction, that would be great. Thanks.

No need to take the EM off, the stock turbo can be wiggled out, you may need to either lower or raise the engine a bit.

For heatshield bolts, spray them with PB Blaster, maybe bang on them gently with a rubber mallet or something to loosen them up. In the worst case, cut the shield and buy a replacement on the forum for cheap.

[Mandinca]

I took mine off and never bothered putting them back on again. PB Blaster works wonders, use some of that if the WD40 doesn't work.

[Code Monkey]

Originally Posted by Mandinca I took mine off and never bothered putting them back on again. PB Blaster works wonders, use some of that if the WD40 doesn't work.

PB Blaster, I was drunk.

[Mandinca]

I'm curious to hear how @Heartbreak1; gets on with the oil drain removal. It stopped me dead in my tracks. I think the next time I do the turbo removal I'm just going to saw that fucker in half and put a new one on. Even at $120 it's porobably worth it to avoid the aggravation. I'm actually going to try to mod one using braided hose with hex nut connectors at both ends - much easier to get a wrench to making turbo removal much much easier :-)

[Code Monkey]

Make sure you do not fail like me here.

To get around the TC, I think this will work on the TC side:

-- flange with a female thread
-- either a 45 or a 90 degree fitting, 1/2" NPT to -10an
-- then a -10an straight swivel hose end fitting

When I get my engine built, I think I will go with a weld-on oil drain bung.

[Mandinca]

I would never have known that the transfer case was in the way and would have cut my OEM pipe just to get the turbo off......leaving me with no car. I'm glad we had this conversation !
I actually have a spare motor in my garage so I can mock up the oil drain on that. No spare transfer case although I could probably mock up the piece of transfer case that is in the way using a piece of cardboard.
How do you plan to protect your drain pipe from heat ?

[torquemaniac]

Originally Posted by Mandinca I'm curious to hear how @Heartbreak1; gets on with the oil drain removal. It stopped me dead in my tracks. I think the next time I do the turbo removal I'm just going to saw that fucker in half and put a new one on. Even at $120 it's porobably worth it to avoid the aggravation. I'm actually going to try to mod one using braided hose with hex nut connectors at both ends - much easier to get a wrench to making turbo removal much much easier :-)

If you think removing the turbo is a PITA, wait till you put it back on...there is a metal gasket on the oil return line to turbo connection...that gasket keeps falling when you try to put the turbo back in position...I had to clean the oil return line and put some RTV to hold the gasket in place...only problem now is I have some small leak

The custom or DIY oil return line is a very good idea...

[Mandinca]

Originally Posted by torquemaniac If you think removing the turbo is a PITA, wait till you put it back on...there is a metal gasket on the oil return line to turbo connection...that gasket keeps falling when you try to put the turbo back in position...I had to clean the oil return line and put some RTV to hold the gasket in place...only problem now is I have some small leak The custom or DIY oil return line is a very good idea...

I'm thinking I can possibly put it back on from underneath by attaching the oil drain to the turbo first, then from underneath bolt the other end of the drain to the block.
I didn't attempt to undo it from underneath when I attempted the turbo removal because I was paranoid that the bolts would shear and I'd be completely fucked then.
With the turbo out of the way I would be able to access the block end of the oil drain much more easily and removal of the bolts would be easier.
Also, prefabbing the modded oil line with a hex nut to a male flange bolted to the block would take most of the drama out of this.

[Heartbreak1]

since im awd, i think my transfer case is in the way. If that's the case, will I have to pull the turbo form the to by removing the exhaust manifold?

[Heartbreak1]

so nvm guys, there's a whole in my block. This turned into a whole bottom end build and turbo replacement.

[Mandinca]

Originally Posted by Heartbreak1 so nvm guys, there's a whole in my block. This turned into a whole bottom end build and turbo replacement.

Shit, that sucks.
@aviator79; and I just did a full motor swap in about 30 hours. About 2 hours of that was just spent trying to get the driver side drive shaft back in. We took the motor out of the top but it might have been easier to pull the whole front off. I didn't want to discharge the AC so we decided just to unbolt everything and tilt it forwards. Without doing that we weren't able to create enough room for the PTO flange to clear the bulkhead. Engine hoist with a load leveler.....and two people preferably.

Originally Posted by Code Monkey Make sure you do not fail like me here. To get around the TC, I think this will work on the TC side: -- flange with a female thread -- either a 45 or a 90 degree fitting, 1/2" NPT to -10an -- then a -10an straight swivel hose end fitting When I get my engine built, I think I will go with a weld-on oil drain bung.

Can you let me know what ends up working for you, clearance and heat wise. I'll need to do a mod like this at some point since my K04 smokes at idle and no amount of "fixes" are working.

[Code Monkey]

Originally Posted by Mandinca I'm thinking I can possibly put it back on from underneath by attaching the oil drain to the turbo first, then from underneath bolt the other end of the drain to the block.

You can only see/access one bolt on the block side from underneath IIRC and you better have a long ass ratcheting wrench. The other one has to be accessed from top, I think. Whatever the case may be, my plan for my GTX install is to attach the oil drain line to the turbo first and then worry how I will do the block side.

Originally Posted by Mandinca Can you let me know what ends up working for you, clearance and heat wise. I'll need to do a mod like this at some point since my K04 smokes at idle and no amount of "fixes" are working.

I will be trying (again) the stock line tomorrow or Wednesday. If this does not work, I will go the route I outlined above.

[Mandinca]

Originally Posted by Code Monkey You can only see/access one bolt on the block side from underneath IIRC and you better have a long ass ratcheting wrench. The other one has to be accessed from top, I think. Whatever the case may be, my plan for my GTX install is to attach the oil drain line to the turbo first and then worry how I will do the block side. I will be trying (again) the stock line tomorrow or Wednesday. If this does not work, I will go the route I outlined above.

I want to know how the stealerships do it. They did a warranty swap on my turbo in a day.
What about cutting the stocker in half and inserting a piece of flexible hose so that once the turbo is unbolted you can flex it in a direction that gives you access to the oil drain on the underside.

Let me know which of those flanges and connectors you end up using. There has to be a way to make this easier.

[Code Monkey]

Originally Posted by Mandinca I want to know how the stealerships do it.

I am pretty sure they pull the engine.

[Mandinca]

Originally Posted by Code Monkey I am pretty sure they pull the engine.

In a freakin day ?
I guess it's easier when you have a lift but still....

[Code Monkey]

I am about to slit my wrists, FML.

[Code Monkey]

Ok, per workshop manual section 01-13B-7 to remove the oil lines you need to pull the cowl and the alternator, lol.

[802MS3]

damn thats a bitch. on the 3, you can just pull the intake/battery/egr, and pull the turbo out the side, leave the exh mani bolted to the head. good luck man.

[Mandinca]

Originally Posted by Code Monkey Ok, per workshop manual section 01-13B-7 to remove the oil lines you need to pull the cowl and the alternator, lol.

Yeah, right.

[torquemaniac]

FYI, here is the easiest way I found to remove the oil return line from the turbo (as done on my CX-7...with the transfer case in the way like on the MS6) :

- Remove all heat shields
- Get the downpipe out of the way
- Remove the exhaust manifold
- Remove or loosen the coolant line that is between the block and turbo (to get access to the bolt nearest the block)
- Take a small (1/4) ratchet with a 8mm socket (you will need a 2’’ extension to get to the bolt nearest to the block)
- Lay on the engine with your face against the cowl/wiper section, then reach the bolt from where the downpipe was (removing the exhaust manifold gives some more space...)
- At that point, the only issue is applying enough torque to unscrew the bolts in this awkward position

Hope this help...