3rd gear lockout when drag racing

[Flawless]

So I tried to search for solutions to this, and while I think I have a grip on the problem, I want to know how to FIX it.

I take my ms3 to the strip strictly for fun, and I've not once managed to have a clean pass. Every. Single. Pass. I get locked out of 3rd. I could concede that perhaps I had missed pushing the clutch down all the way a few times, but not the 15 or so times I've had a run. I've tried FFS, and regular shifting. No gear gives me any trouble but 3rd. After about 3 seconds of furiously coasting like an idiot, I manage to get into the gear and get going.

It happens very irregularly on the street, but every time on the track.

I've read that perhaps it's due to motor sway? And that i need a new rear motor mount. Or that it could be due to transmission movement, and I need a new tranny mount OR that it has to do with the crappy stock mazda shifter, and a short shifter would clear it up.

I'm running stage 1, street tires. It seems LESS prone to happening when I have my large boyfriend in the car with me (more weight in the front? idk)

I DID manage to just ram it in there once (bad me) but it threw a fit about it.

What should I be looking to buy to fix this? Like I said, strictly for fun, I'd like to get at least one clean pass that wasn't over a 16 . . .

[Jansi]

I tried to ram it in a few times too... Seems like they always throw a fit!

[Mike@Stratified]

When you say you tried FFS, what value do you have it set to in your map or when you flashed the map if you are using the new feature with the APv3?

[snailD]

Originally Posted by Flawless So I tried to search for solutions to this, and while I think I have a grip on the problem, I want to know how to FIX it. I take my ms3 to the strip strictly for fun, and I've not once managed to have a clean pass. Every. Single. Pass. I get locked out of 3rd. I could concede that perhaps I had missed pushing the clutch down all the way a few times, but not the 15 or so times I've had a run. I've tried FFS, and regular shifting. No gear gives me any trouble but 3rd. After about 3 seconds of furiously coasting like an idiot, I manage to get into the gear and get going. It happens very irregularly on the street, but every time on the track. I've read that perhaps it's due to motor sway? And that i need a new rear motor mount. Or that it could be due to transmission movement, and I need a new tranny mount OR that it has to do with the crappy stock mazda shifter, and a short shifter would clear it up. I'm running stage 1, street tires. It seems LESS prone to happening when I have my large boyfriend in the car with me (more weight in the front? idk) I DID manage to just ram it in there once (bad me) but it threw a fit about it. What should I be looking to buy to fix this? Like I said, strictly for fun, I'd like to get at least one clean pass that wasn't over a 16 . . .

what are the mods on the car? do you have a fully stock shifter?

[Mike@Stratified]

Originally Posted by snailD what are the mods on the car? do you have a fully stock shifter?

Also, what fluid in the trans?

[Flawless]

Stock fluid in trans

Stock shifter. I'm stage 1 with a Sri, tip, and some Springs. I'm using a v2 with my ffs limit at 5800 I believe. Shifting at 5.5k or slightly after. I have no problem with ffs on the street (it reduces this lockout issue) but it didn't help at all on the track.

[snailD]

Originally Posted by Flawless Stock fluid in trans Stock shifter. I'm stage 1 with a Sri, tip, and some Springs. I'm using a v2 with my ffs limit at 5800 I believe. Shifting at 5.5k or slightly after. I have no problem with ffs on the street (it reduces this lockout issue) but it didn't help at all on the track.

try adjusting your shifter, and try taking the shifter weight off you will feel the gears much better.

switching the trans fluid to the motorcraft stuff makes it all feel much better too

[Flawless]

I'm assuming that's the weight located around the base of the shifter. Is it fine to run without it completely? I know cobb sells some kind of replacement or something . . .

[WetzMS3]

The shift weight is located above the trans at the end of the shift linkage. Removing the weight may help.

Do you have an aftermarket RMM, I didn't see that in your mods. Replacing the shitty OEM rear mount may do wonders to help this.

[Flawless]

I do NOT have an aftermarket RMM, and knew that I'd need one eventually. I was just putting it off because I had HPFP internals higher on the list hah.

[acousticdefbot]

it's in the engine bay.



edit:

as for adjusting your shifter, follow along with this:

YouTube Short

YouTube Short

[WetzMS3]

Originally Posted by Flawless I do NOT have an aftermarket RMM, and knew that I'd need one eventually. I was just putting it off because I had HPFP internals higher on the list hah.

Put both on the list!

[Flawless]

When doing the motor mount, is upgrading just the rmm an okay choice? I'm looking at picking up a cp-e stage one in 75A right now.

[snailD]

Originally Posted by Flawless When doing the motor mount, is upgrading just the rmm an okay choice? I'm looking at picking up a cp-e stage one in 75A right now.

thats all i have, i really like the damond mount tho, i had a cpe stage 1 prior

[acousticdefbot]

on a completely stock vehicle, it's the first thing you should do. i run the cp-e one and it works well. they also offer a stage II one that utilizes a different bushing location, but i can't speak on whether or not it's any better. as you start adding power, you can only benefit from upgrading the other mounts.

[Flawless]

Looking to maintain a "stockish" feel, but want to drop this annoying lockout issue. What would you suggest? I'm on some pretty stiff springs so I'm not terrified of a rough ride (it's not my highway cruiser )

[Castillo817]

Originally Posted by Flawless When doing the motor mount, is upgrading just the rmm an okay choice? I'm looking at picking up a cp-e stage one in 75A right now.

It's not an okay choice, it's a great choice.

[Mike@Stratified]

Try setting FFS lower, ideally right about where your RPMs will been you let the clutch out after your shift. For me, 4900 works, but YMMV.

Sent while Stratified.

[Flawless]

So I just pulled the trigger on a 80a jbr rmm, I wanted a rear sway from them anyway.

I'll update on if it helps at all. I'll also turn the FFS lower, but I've read that that doesn't really seem to effect anything? It works great on the street and all the other gears, just 3rd on the drag strip sucks.

[snailD]

Originally Posted by Flawless So I just pulled the trigger on a 80a jbr rmm, I wanted a rear sway from them anyway. I'll update on if it helps at all. I'll also turn the FFS lower, but I've read that that doesn't really seem to effect anything? It works great on the street and all the other gears, just 3rd on the drag strip sucks.

replacing those rubber bushings with solid ones in the shifter base helps the feel of the shifter too. if it feels better its not as easy to miss the gate

[Mike@Stratified]

I was having the same issue as you. Swapped to FoMoCo fluid in the trans and set FFS to 4900 and the issue went away.

[Spec]

Occasionally I'd have this happen to me as well. Trying to shift as quickly as possible and you'll end up jamming it between 1st and 3rd sometimes. Not saying this is what is happening to you but, it will happen. Start eliminating possible issues, fluids, mounts, bushings and you'll figure it out.

With your car off push up from second and see for yourself about getting stuck between first and third in the shift pattern and just be mindful of it when you race.

[sheston]

I have the same problem as @Flawless; but I have rmm, short shifter kit, and bushings. I don't understand how to adjust the shifter if all the other gears work great. Mine's not everytime, but most of the time that I am going full throttle

Maybe I need to try the unicorn juice, and that may be the magic.

[JgamB]

I was having this problem until I took @Mike@Stratified; 's advice and enabled FFS and reduced the RPM - over-revving seemed to be the culprit. DM RMM and SSP, OEM fluid. If I miss 3rd gear now, I know it was 90% on me.

[fz6brian]

Your FFS has to be set under your shift rpms. Mine is set to 5800, I shift at 6200 and it works better than lifting to shift for me. I have all mounts, shifter plate and bushings, and Ford fluid. I think the fluid did the most.

[Flawless]

What's the specific type of fluid I should be looking for? Is it special order only?

[snailD]

Originally Posted by Flawless What's the specific type of fluid I should be looking for? Is it special order only?

no its at every ford dealership. Its called motorcraft xt-m5-qs

[mazdaspeeding]

There's nothing wrong with your car. You're just shifting too fast and missing third. You need a RMM to hold the motor in place so 3rd gear stays where its supposed to be. Your car is hooking 2nd gear (stage 1, street tires, track) meaning that motor is twisting way out of place and when you go to ram it into 3rd your just missing the gate completely. Trans fluid will help the tranny shift quicker but it won't help you find 3rd. You need a RMM to do that...or wait for the motor to settle back into place then shift.
These tranny's don't like to be shifted fast in any set-up so your gonna have to slow it down regardless. I've made over 400 passes and have missed 3rd plenty of times and they were all my fault, not the cars.

[snailD]

Originally Posted by mazdaspeeding There's nothing wrong with your car. You're just shifting too fast and missing third. You need a RMM to hold the motor in place so 3rd gear stays where its supposed to be. Your car is hooking 2nd gear (stage 1, street tires, track) meaning that motor is twisting way out of place and when you go to ram it into 3rd your just missing the gate completely. Trans fluid will help the tranny shift quicker but it won't help you find 3rd. You need a RMM to do that...or wait for the motor to settle back into place then shift. These tranny's don't like to be shifted fast in any set-up so your gonna have to slow it down regardless. I've made over 400 passes and have missed 3rd plenty of times and they were all my fault, not the cars.

i beg to differ, i can shift as fast as i want and hit the gears. rear motor mount, solid bushings, motorcraft, no shift weight, weighted shift knob, and adjusted shifter to optimal smoothness

[Flawless]

Well I picked up 3qts today, rmm should be here friday and will get installed and I also plan to drop my FFS down to 5200. I don't plan on taking it back to the strip anytime soon (it's a bit of a drive, and last time was such a failure ) Any tips for what I should do next time when I'm actually driving? Should I fiddle with the shift weight?

[fz6brian]

Preload the shifter before the shift so you don't have to coordinate hand and foot. The clutch becomes a switch for the next gear. It'll be in the next gear before you can possibly get the clutch out. I always open palm the 2nd to 3rd and 4th to 5th.

[snailD]

Originally Posted by Flawless Well I picked up 3qts today, rmm should be here friday and will get installed and I also plan to drop my FFS down to 5200. I don't plan on taking it back to the strip anytime soon (it's a bit of a drive, and last time was such a failure ) Any tips for what I should do next time when I'm actually driving? Should I fiddle with the shift weight?

practice on the street, as i said earlier i personally like the shift weight off. If you feel like the gears arent lined up correctly with the shifter you can adjust the shifter itself

[Flawless]

So did the fluid change, still having the issues, but it's only when I'm driving it really, really hard (keep my foot all the way to the floor right up until the shift, instead of sort of "feathering" it out). No rmm yet, but should I try to tinker with the shift linkage?

[mxlplx71]

get the rmm before you rip the plastic pads off the shift forks shifting hard with the engine rocking around. thats an expensive repair.

[snailD]

Originally Posted by Flawless So did the fluid change, still having the issues, but it's only when I'm driving it really, really hard (keep my foot all the way to the floor right up until the shift, instead of sort of "feathering" it out). No rmm yet, but should I try to tinker with the shift linkage?

yes, watch this video. just get it so it feels perfect when driving normally. THEN drive it hard, if you are still missing wait to do the rmm and shifter bushings then try it out and see if you can hit all the gears.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duIbdq-MQtw

[Flawless]

RMM will be here tomorrow or saturday and I don't plan to race again until sunday at the earliest, so won't be driving him too hard except to test. Thanks for the video! I'll work on that, hopefully gives the tranny a little relief from me assaulting it.

[Spec]

Originally Posted by Flawless RMM will be here tomorrow or saturday and I don't plan to race again until sunday at the earliest, so won't be driving him too hard except to test. Thanks for the video! I'll work on that, hopefully gives the tranny a little relief from me assaulting it.

Just so you know too, if you start wheel hopping, let out of it unless you like replacing ball joints and cv axles.

[Flawless]

I figured, will it really go through axles that fast? Ordered a jbr ssp as well today.

[Spec]

Originally Posted by Flawless I figured, will it really go through axles that fast? Ordered a jbr ssp as well today.

You can snap am axle or blow out ball joints or basically find the weak link real fast if you start hopping and stay in it. Just let off, and line up to run again after making adjustments. Tire pressure or any other you may get in the future.

[Flawless]

Originally Posted by Spec You can snap am axle or blow out ball joints or basically find the weak link real fast if you start hopping and stay in it. Just let off, and line up to run again after making adjustments. Tire pressure or any other you may get in the future.

What pressures should I aim to run? Any other adjustments I should be making once I get to the track?