Dales k04 ported and polished (PNP) Intake Manifold results

[dale_gribble]

Ok, so I am wrapping up my last set of bolt on mods... I recently did an exhaust manifold and a CP-E DP. I had a good baseline from those mods with good gains so it was time for my port and polished (PNP) intake manifold. This is the one from NJSPEED3.

The install is a ton easier then the DP or exhaust manifold. It's just one of those things that you take your time on and it just happens. Not a ton of fighting the thing. My IM valves looked great, so I didn't even bother cleaning them. The hardest time I had was lining the EGR nut up with the new IM.

In terms of results, I am a little confused. The datalog data isn't matching my ass dyno. My ass dyno thinks the car had some gains from the IM. The datalog basically says there was virtually no change in HP/TQ.

Here's what the VD looks like. It basically shows no difference; this was true for all of my new runs compared to the baseline runs. This actually shows that I lost a little HP up top from the IM, but that's probably in the noise for the data I think. If there were gains, it is basically in the noise. Kind of a bummer.



Here's the normalizing data; you can see boost, IATs, and BATs are all relatively close for the comparison. All data was taken at 60F ambient.



Maybe you tuners can help out with this because I am scratching my head a little. The car did show gains in calculated load for the same boost, and it picked up 10 g/s up to redline. Why didn't this translate to HP gains on the VD?



EDIT: Logs attached (excel spreadsheet)

[lilred]

I need a ride in your car...

tapafuck

[mxlplx71]

any air temp difference from the runs?

[dale_gribble]

You can see in the normalizing chart that the IATs were within 5F and BATs were relatively close. They aren't dead on, but that's what I am saying is the gains are in the noise. In all of my testing, I have been able to identify gains/trends from changing parts, even with small variations in normalizing data like this.

Originally Posted by lilred I need a ride in your car... tapafuck

Grass, gas, or ass, nobody rides for free.

[lilred]

I release a lot of gass from my ass from the food I eat when I smoke grass...

tapafuck

[Lex]

How was the timing? If you moved load you may have been in a different region for timing.

[dale_gribble]

Here's the Spark advance comparison @Lex;.

[Tokay444]

I wouldn't look to a pnp stock manifold for much in the way of power adding.
At least not on what seems to be a maxed out k04, but more for engine longevity wih a more balanced air flow.

[dale_gribble]

Ya, I guess so. I expected a little something, something, especially after opening the exhaust side up, but I guess the moral of the story is the stock IM flows sufficiently for a k04 running ~21psi tapering to 18.

[Tokay444]

But still, tic another box on the gearhead requierment list for Gribble.

[Lex]

Another thing to keep in mind here. Flow is not everything to power. The mixture of air and fuel is very important and generating enough swirl and tumble is important as the air and fuel have very little time to mix in the combustion chamber.

[silvapain]

A ported IM balances flow. The stock IM is not a restriction on the K04.

A ported IM will actually hurt engine efficiency when cold, as the VCTS has been removed.

[dale_gribble]

NOW you tell me... J/k. Some data/posts out there suggests the PNP is a power adder for k04s.

It's still a good thing I reckon. I must have found my mechanical KR source because my phantom KR is gone now which is awesome. Plus I got to inspect my intake valves and had easy access to rebuild my power steering pump o-ring.

[scubasteve711]

Just my opinion, but the gains of the manifold will be more recognized when you get more turbo u der the hood. Not to mention with more even flow, your cylinder 3 will be happy...

[ckMS3]

Thought it would've added some power at least. Thanks for doing the research.

[mtosofsky]

A couple of Nator FL guys have ported manifolds and they say they felt some gains. To me, im more than okay with just increasing the balance of airflow and better efficiency. Even though some say the stock manifold isnt an issue with the ko4. But for people who run meth injection like myself, this should help with dispersion to each cylinder a little better. Going for a ported manifold/valve cleaning next week. If @dale_gribble; doesn't mind, ill take some before and after logs to post up as well.

[TiGraySpeed6]

I think that if you had started with the IM you would have had an easier time defining it's gains. Now that you've improved the exh flow so much with the mani & dp the improvements from the intake just aren't enough to be easily seen on a VD graph.

Much like the old argument about DP or Exhaust on the Speed6.

[Lex]

This is one of the more concrete and well done tests on a manifold without other variables being changed. A lot of us want to see gains but instead of hypothesizing when and under what conditions we see these gains I'd like to see more proof done like this.

[redboat]

will going to a log style IM like JMF see more of a increase HP with a free flowing exhaust?

[msantana101]

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[mxlplx71]

Originally Posted by redboat will going to a log style IM like JMF see more of a increase HP with a free flowing exhaust?

I'd say it does. I didn't do any testing, just put the JMF intake and FullRace Em on at the same time. my car is lots faster.

evening out flow imbalance for long term durability. peace of mind. = good idea.

[redboat]

Originally Posted by mxlplx71 I'd say it does. I didn't do any testing, just put the JMF intake and FullRace Em on at the same time. my car is lots faster. evening out flow imbalance for long term durability. peace of mind. = good idea.

Did you have to change your tune for the improved flow?

[dale_gribble]

Originally Posted by redboat Did you have to change your tune for the improved flow?

Ya. Depending on your tune: MAF cal, load targets, wgdc.

[sidekick]

The only thing I'm wondering is why @atvfreek;'s results were so much different than yours. I can't remember what turbo he was running though. It may have been the BNR or the GTX28, which would account for the differences.

[Yatta]

Dale, do you have wgdc logs for the before and after runs?

Glad you did this, I have a spare manifold and have been resisting it so far.