MAF calibrations for bigger intakes

[EmPeEs6]

I'm surprised that the very different sized tip, which should influence/restrict the effective flow, as well as the kind of filter used, practically doesn't affect the maf calibration, but thank's for the clarification!

[TiGraySpeed6]

If it helps, think of it this way-

MAF Diameter means large scale across the entire MAF Curve

Filter, TIP etc means small scale fine tuning commonly referred to simply as MAF Calibration regardless of tweaking LTFT's or making adjustments to bring WOT AFR's to the desired targets.


One is often beyond the scope of the ECU to compensate for and is addressed across the entire MAF curve where the other is typically small chunks that get small tweaks.

[Mistersix]

Well i've been trying to get a log of the stumbling start but the car hasn't done it. It still doesn't sound right though. Somethings off.

I did get these two logs. This map has over 300 miles on it and is pretty dialed in as far as CL and OL WOT afr's go. At least until this morning when i noticed a +20 in the second breakpoint. I'm using @Lex; breakpoints of 5.70,12,20,30,40

I also noticed a difference in spark advance during this breakpoint between these two logs.

I've made the adjustment to that break point and will flash tomorrow. I'm betting the car is gonna struggle to stay running during cold start after the new map. Just a hunch.

[tooslowgti]

subbed

[Lex]

Just updated the JBR 3" WP MAF cal.

[MattJackson86]

Any chance of a cal for the SURE Full 3.25?
Full3 Aeros ID325 GT | SURE Motorsports

[jdeves]

@Lex

I'm looking at your HTP 4" cal and I noticed a weird spike between 3.081v and 3.12v you increase here over 2x as much as preceding and following changes. Then between 3.6 and 3.75 the changes are really small so you end up basically lining back up with the trend from before the earlier spike. Is there some reason for this or is it just because of an irregularity in the stock cal getting emphasized by the formula to go to 4"?

[Lex]

Originally Posted by MattJackson86 Any chance of a cal for the SURE Full 3.25? Full3 Aeros ID325 GT | SURE Motorsports

I just added a BETA version of the 3.25" for SURE. Give it a try and post feedback with MAF and WOT logs.

Originally Posted by jdeves @Lex I'm looking at your HTP 4" cal and I noticed a weird spike between 3.081v and 3.12v you increase here over 2x as much as preceding and following changes. Then between 3.6 and 3.75 the changes are really small so you end up basically lining back up with the trend from before the earlier spike. Is there some reason for this or is it just because of an irregularity in the stock cal getting emphasized by the formula to go to 4"?

The HTP MAF cal had to be massaged piecewise due to the honeycomb and this is the effect you are seeing. Do you have a MAF and WOT log - any issues?

[jdeves]

Originally Posted by Lex The HTP MAF cal had to be massaged piecewise due to the honeycomb and this is the effect you are seeing. Do you have a MAF and WOT log - any issues?

I hadn't tried yours yet. I was just looking through the numbers and comparing it to what I currently have set on my own. I'm not very happy with how mine has been running at low rpms though so I'm planning to give yours a try.

[redboat]

Any one using the ATP 3" housing? And any one know the AEM/MS CAI inner diameter at the MAF?

[Ireland]

Subbing

[redboat]

Lex

I'm running my own custom made 3.75" MAF housing w/ 3.5" ID using scalar 1.78715. Shown here..

http://www.mazdaspeedforum.org/forum/foru...um-maf-161689/


I have an optional honeycomb that I can add to it, from your experience with HTP larger MAF housings that have the honey comb install. Does the Honey comb make easier isolate lower percentage LFTF's? Or just make it more of a PITA?

[Lex]

Originally Posted by redboat Lex I'm running my own custom made 3.75" MAF housing w/ 3.5" ID using scalar 1.78715. Shown here.. http://www.mazdaspeedforum.org/forum/foru...um-maf-161689/ I have an optional honeycomb that I can add to it, from your experience with HTP larger MAF housings that have the honey comb install. Does the Honey comb make easier isolate lower percentage LFTF's? Or just make it more of a PITA?

The HTP intake definitely needed more piecewise MAF calibration work. The honeycomb does affect the curve such that you probably have to adjust several areas of the curve independently if you are basing your MAF cal on a pipe with no honeycomb.

[ibcrusn]

Thanks for posting, I cut/pasted the numbers for the 3" JBR silicone intake I installed yesterday. I'll give it a day or so back and forth to work and check the cal.

[Ireland]

Here's a first log after the maf cal for the 3' htp. Did the log to soon I think. I'm targeting 12afrs but fluctuating between 12.2-12.4

[6Y MAZDA]

@Lex; So i used your HTP 3.5" MAF table for my 3.5" intake...
I also scaled my already calibrated MAF table by multiplying it by 1.66.
I tried both maps and am getting some weird results. With both MAF tables i am running very lean at WOT, and also getting some WOT knock retard. Idles at 14.7, it's the WOT that is giving me problems. Boost targets are being hit, so does not seem like a boost leak.

Do you think this is a matter of just taking it easy and not going WOT and letting the LTFT's settle until i can do a MAF cal. Or is my table just way off for some reason?

I have attached a 3rd gear log, and the map that i have scaled using my previous MAF table.

I'd appreciate any help, thanks.

[TiGraySpeed6]

Based on just the one log, and presuming that there are no hardware issues like a post-MAF pre-turbo vac leak sucking in a butt chunk of unmetered air, then you just want to do normal WOT AFR calibration. In this case adding at least 10% then testing for effect. Easy-peasy.

[redboat]

Originally Posted by 6Y MAZDA @Lex; So i used your HTP 3.5" MAF table for my 3.5" intake... I also scaled my already calibrated MAF table by multiplying it by 1.66. I tried both maps and am getting some weird results. With both MAF tables i am running very lean at WOT, and also getting some WOT knock retard. Idles at 14.7, it's the WOT that is giving me problems. Boost targets are being hit, so does not seem like a boost leak. Do you think this is a matter of just taking it easy and not going WOT and letting the LTFT's settle until i can do a MAF cal. Or is my table just way off for some reason? I have attached a 3rd gear log, and the map that i have scaled using my previous MAF table. I'd appreciate any help, thanks.

Your scalar is off. My 3.75" MAF has a 3.5" ID. But when you use the HTP 3.5" MAF scalar, you didnt take into account that its ID is less then 3.5" this is why you're running lean.

[Lex]

You have to measure the ID of your MAF housing as specified above. The HTP pipe is 3.37x iirc ID.

[6Y MAZDA]

@redboat;

So i saw you scaled yours by 1.78. I am going to try that and hopefully that will fix my situation! Thanks guys.

[TiGraySpeed6]

You're doing an open loop MAF Cal too, right?
not just correcting the LTFT's with the closed loop MAF Cal?

Don't expect just the multiplier to bring the entire MAF Curve on target. You were just told the same thing three times in different language- 12%. If you're using 11.6 as your WOT AFR target- then 13/11.6 = m@1.120, or adding 12%, or conservatively 10% then tweak.

[6Y MAZDA]

Ok so i scaled using 1.78 and flashed it. Of course the LTFT's havent settled, but i am still seeing WOT AFRs of 12-13:1. not sure why it's doing this

Originally Posted by TiGraySpeed6 You're doing an open loop MAF Cal too, right? not just correcting the LTFT's with the closed loop MAF Cal? Don't expect just the multiplier to bring the entire MAF Curve on target. You were just told the same thing three times in different language- 12%. If you're using 11.6 as your WOT AFR target- then 13/11.6 = m@1.120, or adding 12%, or conservatively 10% then tweak.

No i haven't done any MAF cal yet, as i just flashed the map and havent driven 50 miles. So you're saying to get my AFR where it should be i should add 10-12% to the entire curve? (multiply the cells by 1.1)

[TiGraySpeed6]

Basic MAF Cal 101 Hector!
You can set initial fuel trims in as little as 5ish miles by just spending time in each of the ranges. You can look at the STFT's as well, and take them into account if needed. This is the process Cobb talks about in the help file.

30-50 miles just gives more time to let things settle & trims to trend with more stability.

As for the entire curve, I'd grab the MAF Curve from an OTS map, multiply that whole curve by the known multiplier of 1.78 noted above & test for effect, rather than modifying what you were running on your old intake setup. In general tho, bumping your multiplier from the 1.66 you used the first time and then doing it by 1.78 is no different than taking the 1.66 curve result and doing a m@1.12 or conservatively 1.1 (12 or 10%)

If you can make a 10% change to your fueling and not see a resulting change to the monitored results, I'd double check hardware to be sure you're not pulling in unmetered air.

[6Y MAZDA]

Lol OK @TiGraySpeed6;

I feel ALOT better now...i took my 1.78 scale and multiplied it by 1.1. Now its almost dead on 11.6. Thank you! haha. Now i just have to scale my WGDC down by 15% as i am overboosting and hitting boost cut. (hitting up to 23 psi!).

[redboat]

Originally Posted by 6Y MAZDA Lol OK @TiGraySpeed6; I feel ALOT better now...i took my 1.78 scale and multiplied it by 1.1. Now its almost dead on 11.6. Thank you! haha. Now i just have to scale my WGDC down by 15% as i am overboosting and hitting boost cut. (hitting up to 23 psi!).

Did you multiple the scalar to the stock map or an OTS map?

If an OTS Map, what intake set up was it set to?

I made this same mistake, I reverted back to a stock map, and then used my 1.78 scalar.

[6Y MAZDA]

Originally Posted by redboat Did you multiple the scalar to the stock map or an OTS map? If an OTS Map, what intake set up was it set to? I made this same mistake, I reverted back to a stock map, and then used my 1.78 scalar.

I was using a calibrated CS SRI/TIP maf table (from my etune).
Multiplied that by 1.78 and was still off AFR by like 12%...too lean. So then i multiplied again by 1.11 and that got me where i was supposed to be. Then i was overboosting because the hose to the wg actuator was split! But now everything is working as it is supposed to.

[Lex]

Also don't overlook doing a boost leak test when installing new parts. You don't want to calibrate a MAF around a present leak.

[Lex]

Added the Corksport (CS) 3" MAF calibration to the OP so that we have a common resource on the forums. The CS calibration is straight from the CS website.

[2.0t03speed]

Wow the cs flows only 50g's less then the htp 3.5"

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[Chron]

@Lex; you are awesome! Just helped a local install his HTP 3" and I was able to use your MAF tables to get a temporary tune running for him (he's still waiting for his tuner to get back to him). The tables worked great and brought his AFR's back down to normal. :-)

[PapaBruno]

Thank you so much for creating this thread, @Lex. I just bought the CS Power Series 3" intake and have it right here waiting for me to get some free time to install it. I'm very new to car mods, especially to this degree, but thanks to your videos I just performed my first closed-loop MAF Cal. log this evening...at least I think I did it right (attached). @Agent_Orange and a few other members from a thread I created, here: RMM, APV3, and Internals. Guidance/Next Steps have been super helpful, and brought this thread to my attention earlier today.

Admittedly I've only read through about three pages of this thread so far, but with my genpu do I paste the CS log into the bottom field or the top field of MAF Table A in Access TUNER?

EDIT: I'm hoping this will hold me over until I can get an e-tune.
Also, for those AP users out there, an update just went live today.

Post #100 Now, back to reading the rest of this thread.

[Lex]

Originally Posted by PapaBruno Thank you so much for creating this thread, @Lex. I just bought the CS Power Series 3" intake and have it right here waiting for me to get some free time to install it. I'm very new to car mods, especially to this degree, but thanks to your videos I just performed my first closed-loop MAF Cal. log this evening...at least I think I did it right (attached). @Agent_Orange and a few other members from a thread I created, here: RMM, APV3, and Internals. Guidance/Next Steps have been super helpful, and brought this thread to my attention earlier today. Admittedly I've only read through about three pages of this thread so far, but with my genpu do I paste the CS log into the bottom field or the top field of MAF Table A in Access TUNER? EDIT: I'm hoping this will hold me over until I can get an e-tune. Also, for those AP users out there, an update just went live today. Post #100 Now, back to reading the rest of this thread.

Copy all the values from the calibration and then select the first cell in the MAF calibration table and paste. All the values in the MAF calibration table should be updated to match what you copied from here.

Remember to save the map and flash it to your car.

[mrQQ]

Hi,

didn't read all the thread, but, curious - why such BIG g/s difference between different 3" intakes?

[Mike@Stratified]

Added the JBR Tru-3.0 calibration to the OP. This calibration was dialed in on my car and confirmed on the JBR Gen2. Tru-3.5 coming soon.

Originally Posted by mrQQ Hi, didn't read all the thread, but, curious - why such BIG g/s difference between different 3" intakes?

Actual inner diameter (ID) for the various 3" MAF housings are not the same. Also, for the most part the OL areas of the MAF calibrations are best guesses since the ECU has the ability to adjust trims there that we can't see. As long as the calibrations are within about +/- 15% the ECU will keep AFRs in check. The only time this isn't true is when you exceed 2.50 load and then these hidden trims appear to no longer be in play.

[[R]usty]

Originally Posted by Mike@Stratified Added the JBR Tru-3.0 calibration to the OP. This calibration was dialed in on my car and confirmed on the JBR Gen2. Tru-3.5 coming soon.

I was going to ask you guys about this but you beat me to it. Thanks!

[Ozynigma]

Subbed for the 3.5. Mine arrived Monday and needs to be installed before my Stratified tuning experience starts.

[Mike@Stratified]

Originally Posted by Ozynigma Subbed for the 3.5. Mine arrived Monday and needs to be installed before my Stratified tuning experience starts.

We have one that should be close we can use whenever you are ready to get started. Just waiting on Jaime to install one on their gen2 and get me some logs to confirm.

[Ozynigma]

Originally Posted by Mike@Stratified We have one that should be close we can use whenever you are ready to get started. Just waiting on Jaime to install one on their gen2 and get me some logs to confirm.

@Lex you have an email. My last mods will be installed 22nd September.

[Mike@Stratified]

Updated OP with calibration for JBR Tru-3.5 intake.

[SnailSpeed3]

Just wanted to say thanks alot for this info... Made it much easier to just slap in some predetermined values for the Mafcal than to have to figure out a scalar and multiply it through and hope it's close enough... Plus the fact that the values I used for my HTP 3" that I installed this weekend have me at ~ +- 5% LTFT so that's a very nice starting point if you ask me.