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-   -   Alky Control Meth kit (http://www.mazdaspeedforum.org/forum/forum/f736/alky-control-meth-kit-189972/)

Matt@FJPerformance 06-23-2015 10:59 AM

Alky Control Meth kit
 
We wil finally be testing our Alky control meth kit we had designed for the mazdaspeed platform this week. I hope to get some results up in the next few weeks of how it helped. For those of you not familiar with Alky. They have been making meth kits for almost 30 years. In the Forced induction world of V8/V6, there is no better name. Last December we got a chance to talk with Julio of Alky control and have him design a kit exclusive to FJ for our platform. The kit was designed to give a enough meth safely to 750hp on 2 nozzles, once it's all been tested we will give more info on the kit. I know @Justin@Freektune; is very excited to work with this kit! Can't wait to bring this kit to the market for everyone!

Justin@Freektune 06-23-2015 11:05 AM

Really excited to be trying this kit out! They are a huge name in the meth business and I have no doubt the kit they designed for the Speeds and power goals will FLOW some mef

tastysi2004 07-04-2015 08:25 PM

cant wait x2!!!

MD1032 07-05-2015 06:17 AM

Subbed for details. What kind of controller is it going to be running off of?

Matt@FJPerformance 07-05-2015 01:00 PM

Alky has its own controller designed by them. Here is a little tech info on the product

Methonal Injection and the Progressive Controller

A bit of history on the progressive controller and its development.

Years ago, injection systems were marketed using a simple pressure switch, relay, nozzle, and pump. This is a very basic system and is still sold by many companies. From the beginning, this design had weaknesses. First, HOW MUCH liquid is needed by the engine to prevent detonation. What is needed in order to achieve a balance of system pressure vs. nozzle orifice sizing? Example: Let's say one needed 600 CC’s/minute at 15 PSI boost, then you would change the nozzle to achieve this setting. The problem is, how do you know you need the 600 CC’s when at 15 PSI boost? Enter the "trial and error" phase of system tuning...lots of guessing and nozzle changes.

The next advancement was the use of a variable voltage controller which could be located in the "cockpit". Now, changes to pump voltage drive could occur. Reducing voltage drive reduced output and determining that 600 CC level could be accomplished in a more rapid fashion without changing “lots” of nozzles/jets.

Great new feature with minimal experimentation...now the engine is detonation-free at 600CC's and 15 PSI boost, right? Wait, there's another new hurdle. When the boost needle hits 15 PSI, we realize there is a system "time-delay". When we tell the pump to activate, it's motor needs to spin, lines must fill, liquid passes through the nozzle, past the throttle body, past the intake valves and finally into combustion chambers. Solution? Activate the system at 10 PSI (or even less) to offset the time needed for liquid to reach the combustion chamber. Now, when 15 PSI is reached, the proper amount is being delivered under those conditions. Finally, all bases covered, right? Wrong! Now the issue is during a part throttle condition. When at 10 PSI, the motor will have far too much liquid at the lower boost level and will create surging and bogging at the activation set point.

Ain't evolution fun? Now let's consider a "staged" setup where one small nozzle activates at 8 PSI and another at 13 PSI, so that at 15 PSI we would have the proper volume. Now we have adequate flow at the desired boost level...in a more gradual fashion. But wait! Due to the multiple pressure switches, solenoids, relays and wiring, the "plumbing" will be a nightmare when it comes to troubleshooting and/or service. Another issue...the above setup ONLY provided a specified amount at a specific boost level. In a turbo application it is possible for wastegate malfunctions to create boost levels much higher than the 15 PSI that was set. So, if the boost spiked to 20 PSI, we are only injecting enough to sustain 15 PSI. This could be followed by a “dead band” condition associated with mechanical switches, especially inexpensive types. Example: Let's say it activates at 8 PSI, but does not deactivate until under 3 PSI. Understand that pressure switches are mechanical in nature and each will have it's own characteristics. This is the reason we don’t use mechanical pressure switches to control key functions within the system...like activation.

The fix for tuning issues associated with above systems was relatively simple. We created a way to develop a voltage "curve" based on boost pressure. The higher the boost, the more voltage sent to the pump, which creates higher pressure. This allows the system to activate early on, fill the lines at low pressures, while not affecting performance. This arrangement also provides the ability to continue add volume as manifold pressure is increased. This may sound easy, but here is where it gets a bit complex.

The “curve” MUST be tailored to the engine’s volumetric efficiency. Simply put, having a simple activation/set point and maximum does not allow this to happen in every engine.
Only recently have other companies begun to realize the need for changing the curve of their progressive controllers. Some now have added “Set” and “Max” settings. Recently, some have initiated thoughts about utilizing a microprocessor to control the injection process.

Here is my take on that idea...
As stated above, an injection system is comprised of a tank, pump, nozzle and electronics. The mechanical device in question is a relatively large pump with significant mass, capable of moving a lot of fluid at high pressure. Inherent is a rise and fall in pressure which takes time to achieve. Remember the "time-delay" issue earlier in this article (the system must activate earlier than needed)? The limiting speed factor in the system is the pump. A 64 MHZ processor will not spin the pump any faster or slower than a switch, meaning the system is only as fast as its slowest device. Abrupt changes to voltage will not cause abrupt changes to pressure. Rise and fall times are mechanical. Think of it like a garden hose with the handle open and someone opening and closing the valve abruptly. This is why there is confusion by those who think the systems work like fuel injectors that can be varied instantly. Also remember that the nozzle placement in front of the throttle body produces an additional "time delay". Redundant, important point...abrupt voltage variations CANNOT produce INSTANT delivery of liquid into the engine.

In our case, simplicity was one of the goals. Now, what do we do that is different and why?

Our main controller has three boxes, purposely designed for achieving various goals.
First, the large pump draws considerable current. At 250 PSI on a 15 gallon per hour nozzle. the pump motor draws in excess of 12 amps and spikes will be even higher. Higher currents generate heat and this heat MUST be dissipated. The driver module on our controller is basically a very large heat-sink designed to keep heat away from the main controller PCB and its components and that is the reason it is mounted away from the PCB. It is rated at 45 amps and will sustain a constant high current load for hours without failure. The design is overkill and creates more work for us in building the unit, but the end result is a bullet-proof device. This assures zero heat stress to the main PCB and results in a reliable device. The main PCB and heat-sink are encased in a special polymer to keep parts from moving, similar to aftermarket ignition systems. An encased PCB will not develop bad connections due to vibration issues, such as racing an engine, suspension system, etc. Vibration is an important issue in a hostile environment like an automobile interior where temperatures can range from below freezing to "desert conditions". Controllers should be mounted in the interior...NOT in the engine compartment.

Lastly, the 3rd box of our system allows for custom placement of the controls into flat panel surfaces or be mounted as is (installation flexibility).
The aftermarket now pushes for smaller controllers (at the expense of reduced or eliminated heat sinking). You simply cannot transfer heat without an adequate heat sink. Designs from certain competitors mount the pump driver right on the PCB. Obviously, this makes for a smaller controller, but one subjected to tons of heat cycling. This is NOT an area where size should be reduced. Solder breaks down after repeated heating, cooling, heating, cooling, etc. Some systems don’t allow the ability to be switched on/off. In others, one cannot “test” the system. These are basic, important details lost in an effort to reduce costs. Rest assured, regardless of production costs, we strive to cover all areas, including surge suppression, reverse polarity protection, charging system malfunctions, wiring shorts, etc.

neganox 07-06-2015 05:24 AM

Soooooooooo

http://hdwpics.com/images/0422AF5F3E...e-my-Money.jpg

Matt@FJPerformance 07-07-2015 08:50 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Here is a little teaser of everything but the fuel cell included in the kit. It comes with 4 gallon fuel cell as well. We expect to have the kit ready for sale by August 1st.

neganox 07-08-2015 05:21 AM

I spy braided lines. I'm assuming fuel cell is for the hatch area?

Matt@FJPerformance 07-08-2015 05:50 AM

Yes, the fuel cell will be for the hatch area and yes braided lines through out!

Matt@FJPerformance 07-17-2015 05:56 PM

2 Attachment(s)
some pics of the meth lines used

nindoja 07-17-2015 06:47 PM

Will the lines be available separate from the kit?

Matt@FJPerformance 07-17-2015 06:52 PM

No they are designed to work with this kit only

my2k13speed3 07-20-2015 06:15 PM

Any rough pricing on this kit? I'm getting ready to pick up a meth kit, this one looks very nice...

ItsNox 07-29-2015 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my2k13speed3 (Post 2920453)
Any rough pricing on this kit? I'm getting ready to pick up a meth kit, this one looks very nice...

I'm loving how this kit looks. We need prices!! And details!

my2k13speed3 07-29-2015 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ItsNox (Post 2925643)
I'm loving how this kit looks. We need prices!! And details!

Agreed we need pricing and details!

acidplant 07-29-2015 12:14 PM

Good day ALL...I'm about to do major upgrade to my Speed6 in November and wall looking for a Kit...Just in time..I hope.....Help and assistance would be great from everyone here as well...I'm new to this.

Matt@FJPerformance 07-29-2015 01:09 PM

$949 will be the retail. We will be launching specifics about the kit next week. We are done with tuning and testing now! Can't wait to have it officially on the market to everyone


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neganox 07-29-2015 06:10 PM

My body. Is ready.

BLKSTIG 07-29-2015 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt@FJPerformance (Post 2925781)
$949 will be the retail. We will be launching specifics about the kit next week. We are done with tuning and testing now! Can't wait to have it officially on the market to everyone


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

with 1st ten buyer special pricing right hehe

Poohster 07-30-2015 10:30 AM

Alky- control meth was recommended as the WMI kit to get by a good friend. Unfortunately, I purchased but haven't installed yet, a Snow Performance Stage 2 WMI kit. ARRGGGHHH Should have waited!!!!!!!

neganox 08-03-2015 06:53 AM

Will the kit have an option for those of us wanting to run multiple nozzles?

Matt@FJPerformance 08-16-2015 06:21 AM

It comes with Dual nozzles standard! It will be able to run single if you choose to

Amnesiac 08-16-2015 06:27 AM

Were there plans for a MS6 option, or did you need a car at your shop for fitment on that?

Matt@FJPerformance 08-16-2015 06:33 AM

It works the same with the MS6 :)

Djohns 08-16-2015 08:35 AM

Now I'm pretty new to meth so please bare with me here lol but I plan on running meth next summer and doing a ton of research over the winter months. But if I'm understanding correctly, this kit cost quite a bit more than a DO or SP correct? Why is that?

taf0422 08-16-2015 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djohns (Post 2935956)
Now I'm pretty new to meth so please bare with me here lol but I plan on running meth next summer and doing a ton of research over the winter months. But if I'm understanding correctly, this kit cost quite a bit more than a DO or SP correct? Why is that?


Probably due to more advanced controller, braided lines, better pump.

Also, i probably wouldn't be looking at this kit if you're a lower HP though. Now if you were having a hard time deciding between PI and meth then its a toss up. Also, lots of research needs to be done by you prior to running meth. The system also needs to be checked on a regular basis and/or failsafe added

jdmage_mx5 08-16-2015 08:45 AM

Looks like a really nice kit. I'll have to weight the pros and cons of this vs 5th/6th port.

onetechyguy 08-27-2015 10:57 AM

How would this compare to the aquamist kit?

bhigdon101 09-16-2015 10:51 PM

any updates on this kit yet?...

Matt@FJPerformance 09-17-2015 05:59 AM

Yes, it's it launched last month. It's available for sale on our site. It's $949.00.


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Addikted To Boost 09-17-2015 06:01 AM

it's been for sale since the 16th...

bhigdon101 09-17-2015 11:09 AM

seen it was for sale.. was looking for some feedback on it.. reviews or numbers... just little more info from people running it....just got done tuning my car with justin... and he did say he tuned matts car with this kit....even a write up or how to...looks and sounds like the kit i have been looking for with out having to put one together myself...

neganox 09-17-2015 12:10 PM

Alky Control is the real deal. Saving up for one of these myself. No more of this 50/50 mix shenanigans.

Hammology 10-06-2015 10:34 PM

@Matt@FJPerformance; just curious, would you guys be able to provide a bigger tank with this kit upon request?

Matt@FJPerformance 10-06-2015 10:34 PM

Yes, 4 gallon is a pretty good size


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Hammology 10-06-2015 10:35 PM

God damn your muthafucken ninja fast lol

zjnspeed3 10-18-2015 03:09 PM

I'm really considering this kit for next year!! Any word on numbers and data? With I a price this kit carries, I need some solid info!

Matt@FJPerformance 10-18-2015 03:43 PM

Scroll up! Lol. $949 is the price on this kit. And I'm preparing a write up of all the testing. The kit has performed amazing


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

zjnspeed3 10-18-2015 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt@FJPerformance (Post 2968363)
Scroll up! Lol. $949 is the price on this kit. And I'm preparing a write up of all the testing. The kit has performed amazing


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I saw the price the day this was released. Lol it's a doozy! But the numbers this kit makes and the data you and Justin have collected will be the deciding factor for me. The price was never really a factor.

Hammology 10-18-2015 04:29 PM

With everything it comes with this kit is priced well.


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